SHOOTING HENS IN THE SPRING SEASON?

[turkey junky]

exactly my point when in rome gopher...

in 99% of north america spring turkey hunting means hens are off limits & protected... but in SD the odd duck that is not the case???

im with you cut n run i just cant tag a egg layer me my self i have called in 50 times the hens as gobblers so me my self i dont see a real challenge in shooting a hen in the spring time i can kill 15-20 each spring if i wanted & was legal any wear i have hunted... yes gopher i do think the hen killing thing comes from the more old school turkey hunter??? im from MN & we sell very few fall tags compared to the male only spring season so low that we dont have to even apply for the tags any longer... any way i have seen lots of harvested MN turkeys & none have ever been a fall bird or a hen... i have met alot of turkey hunters from many different states & in talking from FL to MT only a handful have hunted the fall season maybe 85%-90% have never even wanted to hunt the fall season like my self & many of these guys had grand slams... what most said when asked about fall season would say is i dont kill hens...??? i know they dont have to shoot a hen just cuz they can but thats the most common answer... & mine as well i have to be honest...

i may be simple minded but yes i do find it very dumb or hard to think that to many turkeys can be a bad thing & that the SD game & fish is forward thinking? i think its way backwards... so we just see it 2 different ways...

ok let there be a over population lets say in any given area... once nature takes its toll & all the hens & poults that cant find a place to make it die off wont the hens & poults in the habitat that could support a good population still be there & in good numbers???

turkeys can fly & will move if there is way to many predators in a given area or chunk of land... they will move miles & miles to find habitat they need...

mississippi dose have that no bird with a beard shorter then 6"inch can be harvested... i think they just want to do the QDMA type pass on the young jakes & then we get more toms mentality... i would agree to that rule if there was rules wear kids & 1st time hunters could shoot jakes if they want... but then again i love eating wild turkey & a big ol MN corn/soy bean eating 16-18 pound jake taste good so ill pass on that but i would still love to hunt MS...

im also very much for the trap & transplant thing if that is the reason for allowing hens to be shot in the spring... im pretty damn sure there is a hole region in montana that needs some major major trap & transplant done the is about a 70%-80% die off in many parts wear it used to be a must hunt destination in SE MT each spring just 6-8 years ago it is very sad that nothing is being done in that region... i have talked to MT game & fish biologist & they just said nothing is in the books for the near future??? thats for the past 3 yrs??? SD is very close & they share a NWTF biologist he said we are working on it hope it happens it will be great to SE montana...

no hard feeling gopher i always like your comments great to hear the other side of things...

[Treerooster]

Excellent post Gopherlongbeards!!!

Lots of good points made!

[shaman]

ok let there be a over population lets say in any given area... once nature takes its toll & all the hens & poults that cant find a place to make it die off wont the hens & poults in the habitat that could support a good population still be there & in good numbers???

Actually no. When you get a die-off, it can often deeply affect the population. It comes on suddenly too. The food runs out, you get a prolonged cold snap and one night, most of the local population dies off. The only good news is that re-population from outside the affected area can be pretty rapid. Within a couple years, turkeys will move in to exploit the local resources. We had a localized one a few years ago near me. As I remember, it was brought on by an ice storm, and it hit turkeys down in a few hollows like a sledgehammer. One guy told me that he was out grouse hunting and kept running into turkey carcasses everywhere. My ridge was not affected, even though I was just a couple miles away. Mind you this is a rare sort of thing, but the effects are pretty complete.

[turkey junky]

ice storms & cold snaps to take there toll on wild turkeys im not saying that dose not happen...

im saying that its very hard for a turkey to eat them selfs out of house & home... turkeys live from the mid west wear it very EZ to find food in the winter to the nomadic merriams in the mountains wear thats not the case & die offs do happen but the cause of death is very rarely due to turkey over population...???

i still find it hard for turkeys with everything they need food water cover will just start dieing once they reach a certain number of turkeys in the area... in new areas wear turkeys are transplanted they go threw a very rapid population rise then fall & then mother nature takes over & figures out how many turkeys can be supported in a given area & the population levels off once again... in a area wear turkeys were overpopulating would that not be the same case??? we have a die off of the turkeys that cant be supported in a given area... then the turkeys that did make it in the area will then be living in that area & start the process again...

death by weather is one thing death by over turkey population is another story... any way if there is a overpopulation in SD & thats how they manage there population with killing hens ok but if they just gave it a few years wouldnt the turkey overpopulation take effect & bring the turkey numbers down???

lets say we have a turkey die off in SD i highly doubt the SD GAME & FISH will stop the hen killing in prairie units & killing a hen when a population is low is really really bad in my book...

[ylpnfol]

[quote any way if there is a overpopulation in SD & thats how they manage there population with killing hens ok but if they just gave it a few years wouldnt the turkey overpopulation take effect & bring the turkey numbers down???

...[/quote]

ok, so hunters harvest some hens for the pot, instead of leaving them on the forest floor to rot.....

[turkey junky]

worms got to eat 2 ylpnfol

[Gopherlongbeards]

[quote any way if there is a overpopulation in SD & thats how they manage there population with killing hens ok but if they just gave it a few years wouldnt the turkey overpopulation take effect & bring the turkey numbers down???



ok, so hunters harvest some hens for the pot, instead of leaving them on the forest floor to rot.....

This is the basic idea behind modern wildlife management techniques. Yes, "mother nature" will settle on a sustainable population of turkeys on her own, but if those birds are going to die anyways, many folks are of the mind that we may as well let hunters take them. In many cases a population that is sustaining some harvest will actually become LARGER and contain more biomass than an unharvested population. Harvest keeps the population young, healthy, and in the "drive to expand" mode. Do some google searches (google scholar if you're really interested) on Maximum Sustainable Yield (MSY) and game bird populations. below is a quick read on the general idea (yes it's wikipedia, but in this case mostly accurate).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximum_sustainable_yield

Oh and TJ, no hard feelings at all. Discussion with different viewpoints is what makes life interesting. There are no "wrong" opinions on this issue.

[turkey junky]

cool gopher i always respect your views & comments even if they differ from mine... its the guys that come on with a few short smart a** comments that do bug me... its a forum for people to state there opinions on not try to shut other guys up???

if you dont like the topic of the thread then just dont leave a comment...???

many folks want to hunt wear others have not hunted for years as the game populations there are alot of times better then wear there is heavy hunter harvests & pressure... & turkeys have a very fast turnover rate like every 3-5 yrs all the turkeys in a given area are not the same birds that were 3-5 yrs prior & thats how when u get 2-3 consecutive bad winters & cold springs the turkey population in a give n area basicly all die off like in MT... there is great habitat there with no birds cuz the population is gone... less is not more in that region of MT turkey reproduction wise they need more hens to make more babys...

[kygobbler]

After reading thru I thought I might add my two cents. As far as killing hens I have no problem with it at all during the fall season. I have taken my fair share of hens and have enjoyed hunting, shooting, and eating them as thou they were a grand prize gobbler. Now as far as shooting one in the spring I think its a different story. I would let them pass so they could reproduce for future hunts. With that being said I might eat my own words if a bearded hen walks up this spring. I've never seen one before so Im not sure if I would pull the trigger or not.

If SD is letting their hunters shoot hens in the spring then I believe that is their way of trying to get the population down. The major problem I have with their rules is using riffles or 44 cal (or bigger) muzzleloaders. Clearly these bullets are going straight thru the turkeys and not stopping until they hit something or someone. To me, that is very unsafe and possible life threating, because you know some yahoo will have tunnel vision and not pay attention to what is or could be on the other side of the turkey.

As far as transporting the birds to a different area that has a poor turkey population. My guess on why they are not doing this deals more on the economics than with not wanting to do it.

[ylpnfol]

if you dont like the topic of the thread then just dont leave a comment...???

now who's tryin to shut up whom, don't be hate n, piece out.....